Monday, October 17, 2011

8 comments MMQB Review: If Coaches Wore Suits This Wouldn't Happen Edition

I'm not sure if you heard, but there was a fight between Jim Harbaugh and Jim Schwartz after the Lions and 49ers played yesterday. I am kidding about anyone not hearing since this seems to be the main story from Week 6 in the NFL. Peter King heard and has the solution to end all fights between coaches, since this thing apparently happens all the time now. The solution? Suits. I don't mind suits on coaches, but I'm not sure it will end all of these fights between head coaches. Peter disagrees.

The NFL likes coaches to wear licensed casual apparel on the sidelines (not "likes;'' more like "mandates''), and maybe there'd be more dignity in sideline decorum if the league went back to allowing coaches to dress like businessmen.

Occasionally, I wish head coaches dressed up a little bit more and wore suits on the sidelines. Having said that, I also don't really what a coach wears during the game. Mostly, I’m not sure that would have prevented the Harbaugh-Schwartz confrontation from happening. Basketball coaches wear suits to every game and that doesn’t prevent two coaches from getting into it at times and we all have that picture in our head of Jeff Van Gundy desperately holding onto Alonzo Mourning’s leg during a brawl. Suits look nice, but don’t prevent fights. I didn't mean for that to rhyme.

Maybe that would have prevented 49ers coach Jim Harbaugh, after a huge win at Detroit, from flying off the sidelines like a bottle rocket and slapping Lions coach Jim Schwartz like a player on his team who'd just scored a touchdown.

Suits aren’t incredibly comfortable and restrict leg movement, so perhaps Harbaugh’s skipping across the field after the game would have been restricted in some fashion, but a suit would not have stopped the situation from occurring. I'm not sure a person acts incredibly different than he/she otherwise would simply because they are dressed up nicely.

And maybe it would have stopped Schwartz, though understandably ticked off at Harbaugh's exuberance, from chasing after him the way he'd chase the kid on the block bullying his fourth-grader.

Probably not. Though if we continue with this line of thinking...should have hockey players wear suits on the ice to help prevent in-game fights? Now there is an idea and I am sure Peter would support this idea.

Harbaugh lit the fuse. Schwartz exploded.

Harbaugh was excited his team won. He skipped like a child and then seemed to give a hard handshake and be moderately disrespectful in doing so by not lingering for words after the game with Schwartz and hitting Schwartz’s hand hard while shaking hands. Schwartz was frustrated his team just lost at home to Harbaugh’s team and acted out of frustration. It was a handshake at the end of the game and I am not sure a confrontation was necessary.

On all the TV shows, including my stint on NBC, as much attention (maybe more) was paid to the bizarre sights of an orgasmic Harbaugh and a losing-it Schwartz than to an incredible game between two of the best teams in football,

Harbaugh’s team came onto the Lions’ home field and beat them. Enthusiasm on one side and anger on the other side is to be expected. Harbaugh was a little over the top in his enthusiasm and I bet he wouldn’t have liked it if another head coach had acted that way. Simmer down. Schwartz was mad his team lost a big game, but this isn’t a street fight. Chalk it up to Harbaugh’s enthusiasm and know you will play his team again, so don't overreact to his enthusiasm. Maybe you will be able to skip on the 49ers field in the rematch.

At NBC, we not only used the accusatorily mellow sound bite of Schwartz and the mea-culpa bite from Harbaugh, but also looked at the Baltimore-Houston game.

Not blaming us; the coaching confrontation was the wildfire story of the day at 7 p.m., for better or worse, and our job at NBC was to mirror that, cover it from all angles, and reflect what everyone was talking about.

This is my least favorite media exercise. It is the “We focused on a story we didn’t want to focus on because that’s what you all want us to do. It isn’t our fault we covered the story because we can’t control what stories we do and do not cover. You as the fan compel us to cover the stories you want us to cover and we have no ability to decide what stories we cover. Naturally, this doesn’t explain why we ram stories you don’t care about down your throat, but shut up. It’s all your fault as the viewer.”

This same media exercise was seen when Alex Rodriguez opted-out of his contract before the World Series was over in 2007. The media reported on his opting-out and then reported how this was terrible of A-Rod to do. The hypocrisy of reporting on the A-Rod opting-out story and then complaining A-Rod opted-out during the World Series and took the focus off the game was too funny for me. It was as if the sports media didn’t realize their breathless coverage of A-Rod opting-out was part of why the story “overshadowed” the World Series. No one forces a network to cover a story and they didn't have to cover the story about him opting-out if they chose not to.

but there's something else the league should do: Make each coach either do a PSA about sportsmanship, or appear at a school, with the local media covering it, to talk to student athletes about the importance of sportsmanship.

It was a simple and brief fight. I’m not sure all of this is required. It is a post-game handshake, which the NFL could even get rid of it and 95% of people would not care.

Sorry if I come off like your nerdy, ancient high school gym teacher,

You’re not at this point yet, but if you wait for the locker room to clear out and then have to ask me a “question” at the very second I am changing out of my gym shorts then I may accuse you of being my high school gym teacher.

With the egalitarianism of the East and the presumed knock-each-other-off dogfight in the South, why can't the Niners win 12 or 13? Have you seen them play?

Yes, I have seen them play. Did you watch them play before yesterday?

Not to get ahead of ourselves, but in the words of teens everywhere, I'm just saying.

Ok, now you sound like my nerdy, ancient high school gym teacher. Which way is your windowless van again?

On to the game in Detroit.

Let's go.





Not altogether pretty,

Rough around the edges.

but gritty.

but got the job done.

It reminded me of something Bill Cowher used to tell his Steelers before road games

“I’m going to get really close to you and spit on you while I talk pretty much the entire game. Also, does my chin make me look fat and has anyone noticed the Steelers are a good organization and I am probably a little bit overrated as a head coach?”

Harbaugh's made the mix work. What's amazing about the job he's done is that he didn't know most of these players before July 25. He was installing a new offense, and defensive coordinator Vic Fangio was tinkering with what the Niners did on defense, and the results have been other-worldly.

Vic Fangio’s tinkering: "How about we try something different, like tackle the ball carrier and sack the quarterback as much as possible. Sounds like a plan."

"Jim was tough and gritty and smart and competitive as a player,'' Fangio told me. "He just tries to be himself. And we've got good players. Jim's smart enough to know he doesn't know it all,

"Pfff"…says the media. They think Jim Harbaugh knows everything. He knows so much he knows he doesn’t know everything, but then that’s just proof of how much he actually knows because he is smart enough to know he doesn’t know everything, which actually means he knows everything.

Now for a bit on the dynamic inside linebacker duo. When's the last time a 3-4 had two inside guys who played all three downs? I mean, played every snap?

Oh, You mean every snap? Thanks for clearing that up because I am stupid. Talk down to your readers more Peter, we enjoy it.

Entering Sunday's game, Bowman and Willis had missed 15 of a combined 666 San Francisco defensive snaps.

(Bitter Bengoodfella thinks it must be nice to have your two best LB’s available all season instead of being on IR)

(Aaron) Rodgers doesn't take questions about his relationship with the man he took over for in 2008, because they basically have no relationship.

I haven’t bashed Favre in a few months. I think I will lay off of him here, but it is interesting to know Aaron Rodgers was Favre’s backup for three years and they have no relationship.

I asked him what he thought he'd learned from Favre in his three years as his backup. There was a pause, and I thought he would say some version of no comment, but he said something educational. "I think his eye control,'' Rodgers said.

Eye control. That was the sum total of what Rodgers learned from Favre as his backup. I wish Rodgers had said, “How not to be a selfish asshole and make your teammates hate you,” and then go home to pee in his toilet which has a picture of Brett Favre at bottom of the bowl...but alas he has more tact than I would in that situation.

What exactly is Andrew Luck worth?

As the fan of a team that may have a chance at Luck, I am saying nine 1st round draft picks and nine 2nd round draft picks, but I could be overestimating Luck’s worth.

I think three first-round picks for the first selection in the 2012 draft is more than fair if the team that earns that right is in a dealing mood. One of those picks would have to be in the top 10 of the 2012 draft. "If he's as good as everyone says he is, absolutely it's a realistic price,'' Accorsi said.

For a Pro Bowl greatest quarterback of all-time first-ballot Hall of Famer like Andrew Luck, I think a 2nd and 3rd round pick would need to be thrown in there as well. I would also require a 7th round pick, as well as a $100 gift card to Chipotle in exchange for the rights to Andrew Luck.

But if I were the GM of any bad 2011 team, with any current or near-future quarterback need (and that includes Indianapolis, where the owner is already talking about a Peyton Manning-Luck tag-team for three or four years),

If you are asking me whether I would like to see Peyton Manning freeze out Andrew Luck for three years before Luck takes over the team forcibly in the fourth year as Manning gets traded to the Los Angeles Jaguars for a 2nd round pick…why yes I would.

I wouldn't take any offer for Luck. I'd sit there and pick him. When you don't have a quarterback, and you're in position to take the surest of things probably since Peyton Manning himself came out, you have to take Luck.

Yeah Peter, I think it is pretty much a given that a team with no quarterback is going to take Luck with the #1 overall pick. That is unless a team thinks Landry Jones or Matt Barkley is going to be 15% less of a quarterback than Luck will and that team believes they can get draft picks plus Jones/Barkley. Still, I think it is a given a team with no quarterback will draft Luck and keep him.

Luck has another year of eligibility left at Stanford, but those close to him, and most NFL people I speak to, are virtually certain he'll come out for the 2012 draft. "I am aware of it,'' Luck told Thamel, regarding the sentiment of fans who want their teams to lose to have a shot to draft him next April. "I think it's stupid -- simply put.'' It may be, but that's not going to stop fans in Miami and Seattle and other locales from rooting for their teams to lose.

This is sort of a general question, but are there really fans in Miami and Seattle wanting their teams to lose so they can get Luck? Or is this a media-created story? I tend to think it is media-created.

Knock Mike Brown for not trading Carson Palmer, for not building a consistent winner, and for ignoring the bleatings of generations of Bengals who have begged for him to hire a real general manager. His draft last April was as patient as it was productive. First the pick of A.J. Green in the first round; that surprised no one, and his production (29 catches, 15.6-yard average, four touchdowns) has been consistent with where he was drafted. But the drafting of Andy Dalton, especially where he was drafted, was a risky move that turned out to be a home run.

What? Drafting Andy Dalton with a 2nd round pick was a risky move? He was projected to be a first-round pick by some teams. I don’t see how using a 2nd round pick on him was risky. Guess what? Neither does Peter and he will now undermine his own point.

Starting around the 20th pick in the first round, there was a drumbeat for Dalton. Indianapolis liked him a lot at 22; Seattle loved him at 25, and Buffalo, one pick ahead of Cincinnati at 34th overall, had a quarterback need.

So the risky move was to not trade up for Dalton, but not drafting Dalton until the 2nd round. Got it, I think. Really, the Seahawks and Bills were probably the only teams that would take Dalton, because Indy was smart enough to know they have other holes to fill in the first round.

Cam Newton is starting to look like a rookie. That's not an indictment, merely an acknowledgement of how incredible he was early and how young he looks now ...

This is Peter King paying attention to QB rating only. Newton played better on Sunday than he did in half of his starts and made better reads. Two of his three interceptions weren’t his fault. One was on a brilliant tipped ball by William Moore and the other was a Hail Mary with four seconds left in the game. This hype stuff about Newton’s early performance is overblown simply because his numbers looked great at the time. The hype around him ignores the passes he forced which/should have been picked off in those games. He took what the defense gave him and made better reads against Atlanta. The numbers do look worse, but I think there was progress.

The Rams need to deal for Brandon Lloyd -- and would give a higher pick than San Francisco.

I’m mean to Peter sometimes, but he made a good prediction on this one. Brandon Lloyd did go to the Rams.

4. New England (5-1). Good to know you can call on the two-minute drill when you need it. The Patriots have been laying waste to so many teams they haven't needed to convert a crucial two-minute drive in a while. "We haven't had really a true two-minute situation at the end of the game where we needed a touchdown in a long time,'' Tom Brady said. But he had the 80-yard game-winner in him.

Was there any doubt Tom Brady was going to lead the Pats to a victory against the Cowboys? Other than a complete lack of faith in Tony Romo, of course, why would the Cowboys play it safe on the road offensively like that? The third down draw play really mystified me. I understand the Cowboys don’t want to turn the ball over, but giving the ball back to Tom Brady while the Patriots were at home was just asking for him to score the game winning touchdown. I just feel like the Cowboys needed to do everything to keep the ball and not give it back to Brady.

13. Philadelphia (2-4). I know it's ridiculous to put a 2-4 team ahead of those with much better records.

And yet Peter does it anyway. Gutsy.

But I defy anyone who watched the first half of the game at Washington to say the Eagles aren't one of the best teams in football.

Well, the Bears had a really good couple of drives this week, so shouldn’t this push them into the Top 10 of Peter’s Fine Fifteen? Assuming, we are basing the Fine Fifteen completely on small sample sizes for this week of course.

b. Devin Hester. Said the same thing about Wes Welker last week: There's a good chance we'll be sitting in judgment about Hester for the Pro Football Hall of Fame some year.

What an interesting debate that will be. A guy who plays wide receiver, but it going to make it in the Hall of Fame for his kick and punt return abilities. I’m not sure how I feel about this. He’s only 28, so he has a few more years left, so this debate is incredibly premature.

b. Saturday, noon, college football, Louisville at Cincinnati. Attendance: 40,971. Sunday, 1 p.m., pro football, Indianapolis at Cincinnati. Attendance: 52,068 -- and it absolutely didn't look like that many.

Even in the prosperous times, can you blame Bengals fans for not showing up? They probably feel like they are one season away from being a bad team again.

d. Hey, Jermaine Gresham: A.J. Green's on the team now, and if you drop many more like the wide-open drop you had in the second quarter against Indy, Andy Dalton's going to throw the ball elsewhere.

Hey Peter King: Jermaine Gresham is still a good tight end and if he is open Andy Dalton will still throw him the ball rather than force the ball to an unopen receiver.

4. I think the reason Andy Reid wouldn't be on the hot seat, yet, is because not only hasn't his team quit on him yet, but also the players remain doggedly loyal. "We could be 1-13,'' Michael Vick said after the win at Washington,

(cringes) So when Michael Vick is doggedly loyal, does that mean he will torture Andy Reid to get him angry, have Reid fight another head coach and then kill Reid if he loses?

I’m sorry, that was too easy. I am not making a statement about how I feel about Mike Vick, just a statement I make bad and unfunny jokes.

Then in order to extend my bad joke streak, Peter King tells us about the next Play 60 commercial featuring the Panthers. Apparently the defensive line for Carolina was originally in charge of security for the commercial shoot, in order to prevent too many youth-aged kids from getting on-set while the commercial was being shot, but some really big fifth graders blocked the Panthers' defense line from plugging the entrance to the shoot and a whole group of kids rushed right through on to the set.

(That had all the elements of a terrible joke. It used a vague reference few get, was too long, was not funny, and didn't make an incredible amount of sense.)

8. I think Mike Florio and I are getting the hang of nailing each other pretty good on Friday night,

Seriously Peter, keep your sex life to yourself. We don’t care about your colonoscopy and we really don’t care how good you and Mike Florio are getting at nailing each other.

Calvin Johnson was a pretty easy No. 1, and our lists weren't too different except for one thing: I had Wes Welker three, he didn't have Welker on the list. Florio's of the anyone-can-be-a-slot-receiver-for-Tom-Brady school.

How about we go towards the middle on this issue and say not anyone can be a slot receiver for Tom Brady, but Wes Welker still isn’t the third best receiver in the NFL? That's where I sit.

Third-best? I know he is great at his position, but Peter thinks there are only two other receivers in the NFL that are better than him?

Now, if you want to argue that slot receivers don't have the value of outside receivers, I'd almost get that one -- except that in many offenses, the slot receiver is as important as the outside receiver.

I would counter this by saying in every offense an elite receiver is one of the most important parts of that offense. Welker is great, but he isn’t the third-best receiver in the NFL. Welker is elite, but he isn't the third best receiver in the NFL.

Look at what Peyton Manning did with Dallas Clark in the slot, following what Brandon Stokley had done. In today's offenses, the slot receiver is a vital chain-mover.

I feel like Peter is undermining his own argument here. An elite tight end and Brandon Stokley had success in the slot position, so doesn’t that say a player who is a fantastic slot receiver would have great numbers in an offense where he primarily plays the slot, but so would an elite outside receiver? Namely, an elite outside receiver would be a much better all-around receiver than a slot-only receiver because he can play at a high level no matter where he is on the offense? You can't put Dallas Clark or Brandon Stokley on the outside and expect the same success, while I think Calvin Johnson would still be very effective in the slot.

Maybe not. I won’t say the slot receiver isn’t important, but because Welker is great in the slot doesn’t mean he is a better receiver than every other receiver in the NFL except two guys.

a. What a week it was for birthdays: Favre 42, Steve Young, 50, Jerry Rice, 49, Jerry Jones, 69.

And you thought Peter King couldn’t fit a Brett Favre reference into the column.

My reaction to the Bob Hohler's Boston Globe story on the downfall of the Red Sox: superb story –…

Peter goes on to say there should have been evidence of Francona’s drug use affecting the team, blah, blah, blah. Then he gets to the point.

But overall, the story was very good. So good, in fact, that it drove my brother-in-law (and I assume quite a few others) to say he was finished with paying a dime to the team. He told me he'd be dropping out of our little season-ticket consortium. I'll be very curious to see how much company he has.

I will believe I hear Peter's brother-in-law actually does this. Isn’t this a bit of an overreaction? Just a bit? He can drop out of the season-ticket consortium if you want, but if he buys any Red Sox apparel or watches them on television he is essentially giving the team money. I have a feeling this "I don't give money to the Red Sox" will all be forgotten by Peter’s brother-in-law in two years when the Red Sox are back in the World Series and he is dying to get tickets to a game. Actually, this will all be forgotten in two months.

As kids these days say, I’m just saying.

j. Anyway, here's Schilling on WEEI: "The amount of disrespect that the players involved here showed to each other, to the organization, to Tito [Francona], to the game, is staggering to me. Probably as staggering are some of the names that are on that list. I'm blown away. I'm incredibly disappointed. Things have changed here for a long, long time, and I think it's for the worse. I think the way that this was handled by the organization is pathetic and embarrassing. Why would you want to root for this team?"

Here is the flip side of the story though. This all comes out and is frowned upon because the Red Sox struggled down the stretch. If they had won the World Series I can see the stories about how fried chicken and beer helped the team bond. Everyone would have said it wasn’t a big deal since it didn’t affect the end result of the season and Bill Simmons would make 194 jokes about fried chicken and do a mailbag which helps name fantasy teams based on these fried chicken-beer-Red Sox stories. So while I can see the problem with drinking beer in the clubhouse, if the Red Sox won one more game the story never would have found the light of day, and if it did find the light of day then it would be seen as a team bonding exercise.

l. Really happy, by the way, for the Midwestern teams in the baseball playoffs. Tony LaRussa should be a miniseries. Or a reality show.

Geniuses don’t deserve to be on a reality show, they deserve to BE a reality show.

How sad. I don’t follow Indy Car that closely, but Dan Wheldon’s death somehow just got a little sadder.


cs said...

The coaches should do a PSA about sportsmanship? Seriously? Wtf world are we living in? I loved that they both showed that emotion. I thought it was a fun, emotional and fitting end to an incredible game. Jesus Christ Peter King.

rich said...

And maybe it would have stopped Schwartz, though understandably ticked off at Harbaugh's exuberance, from chasing after him the way he'd chase the kid on the block bullying his fourth-grader.

Or maybe, as a coach who has shown similar amounts of excitement over victories this year should realize that no shit the other coach is going to be excited. I'm sure Schwartz never, ever seemed happy after a win... especially given how pissed off he looked after the lose. No sir, Jim there is a calm, collected fellow when they win.


He skipped like a child and then seemed to give a hard handshake and be moderately disrespectful in doing so by not lingering for words after the game with Schwartz and hitting Schwartz’s hand hard while shaking hands

Oh shit, no he din int ::snaps fingers::. Seriously, Harbaugh's team had just beaten an undefeated team in their home stadium, I'm sure he's not the first to get excited about this.

but there's something else the league should do: Make each coach either do a PSA about sportsmanship, or appear at a school, with the local media covering it, to talk to student athletes about the importance of sportsmanship.

Ya, I couldn't imagine how hilarious it would be watching the PSA by Bellicheck.

Now kids, be a graceful winner. Oh and fuck anything that moves and never, ever, ever smile.

Rodgers doesn't take questions about his relationship with the man he took over for in 2008, because they basically have no relationship.

It's too bad that Rodgers admits that he had a pretty decent relationship with Favre while Favre was still in GB. Now? Ya, I'm sure they aren't really on speaking terms because Favre is a douchenozzle of the highest order.

"If he's as good as everyone says he is, absolutely it's a realistic price,'' Accorsi said.

Says the man who traded John Elway and traded Rivers and a shitload of picks for Eli Manning.

I love Accorsi, but three first round picks? Fuck and no. You give up three first round picks for a QB who is established in the league, not a guy who looks good in college.

When you don't have a quarterback, and you're in position to take the surest of things probably since Peyton Manning himself came out, you have to take Luck.

Again, Peyton Manning wasn't a "sure thing." He almost didn't go number 1 overall to a guy who was out of the league in five years. People had concerns about Peyton, just like they have them about Luck (he throws to his TEs a lot more than I'd think an elite QB should). Now Peyton was a great QB, but lets not make it out like people had Peyton pegged as the superstar all-time great that he became.

But I defy anyone who watched the first half of the game at Washington to say the Eagles aren't one of the best teams in football.

::points to Minnesota Vikings who had half-time leads in their first four games:: Ya, too bad the Eagles completely suck ass in the second half and Vick has left almost every game at some point due to injury.

The did look good in the first half, but Vince Young looked really, really bad the series he came in on and their rushing defense is terrible. Other than that though, ya, they're a great team!

Tony LaRussa should be a miniseries. Or a reality show.

I think he was on cops once...

Martin F. said...

PK, who thinks only the Eagles can have a good first half, it seems.

On the other hand, that Jets/Dolphins game tonight was awful. Marshall is not an elite receiver because he doesn't make the plays he needs to. I thought Gruden made a salient point when he mentioned that this is NOT the 2009 Jets offense. Too much change, not nearly the same players, and it can't use the ground and pound identity because that is not this teams ID.

Anonymous said...

PK just couldn't resist getting in a Favre mention with Rodgers. He probably hoped Aaron would just break down and profess that he learned EVERYTHING from Brettany and he would gladly have the man's children!!!! And PK would just now with satisfaction and arousal.

I'm heterosexual and there's nothing I like better than a girl's tight ass and ripe mellons....But I think I might love Aaron Rodgers in THAT way myself. He bidded his time behind that smug, self-absorbed, penis texting, interception throwing asshole who felt he was bigger than one of the most storied franchises in sports who felt he was above such mundane things like having to EARN your starting job each season. Rodgers never complained, never demanded a trade....and when he got his chance he shoved a Super Bowl title in Brett's ass and has proven to be a better QB then the diva ever was. That's right he's BETTER. He has all the physcial tools and is about a billion times smarter of a QB than Favre was. I doubt Rodgers will ever have Favre's career #'s because I don't think he'll play as long, but he'll have 3 to 5 more SB rings when he retires and be remembered as the best, and most beloved, QB in GB history. And no I'm not a Packer fan.

Favre is a doosh. Talk about a guy who had everything and it wasn't enough. Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy are gods.

Bengoodfella said...

Cs, I know right? A PSA about sportsmanship? How about we just forget about it and remember a brief confrontation after a competitive game isn't something to be overblown.

Rich, after I posted this I read there was more to the story. Apparently Schwartz had dinner with Harbaugh earlier this offseason and said it would take a while for the 49ers to turn it around.

So I am sure that had something to do with it. Honestly, Harbaugh needs to be more professional, but my understanding is Schwartz had stepped on some toes with his attitude as well. It was a big win for the 49ers, so I understand his excitement to a certain degree.

I am sure Rodgers loves Favre more now that Favre said in an interview he was surprised Rodgers didn't win a Super Bowl earlier with the team he had. Yes, it took him 3 full seasons to win a Super Bowl. What a bum.

I had a whole thing about Accorsi written in this post, but edited it out for length. Needless to say, though he has experience w/ #1 overall picks I thought he was an interesting choice since he traded Rivers for Manning. Personally, I still think nine 1st round picks seems about right. Talk to me in December though.

Great point a/b Manning not being a sure thing. I should have caught that b/c the Leaf/Manning debate is recalled often nowadays. Very good point about him throwing to his TEs a lot. Stanford has some good TEs and I feel like if I criticize him for that, then I am being overly nitpicky. Still, I do notice he doesn't use his WR that much, but that may just be a perception thing b/c the 2nd/4th leading receivers are WR for the Cardinal.

Peter's reasoning for the Eagles being ranked as high as they were is just weak. He just wants to rank them high for some reason and makes up a reason.

Martin, did you notice a semi-argument b/w Jaws and Gruden a/b that 2009 Jets remark. Gruden sort of attacked Jaws when he made the comparison and then said they were all different players now. It was a little awkward for a minute. Gruden is right though.

Anon, I tend to feel pretty positive about Rodgers too for many of the same reasons. I don't know if Rodgers will ever break any of Favre's records, but at this point I think he is slowly becoming a little bit better QB just in the way he takes care of the ball. What's interesting is Rodgers doesn't have the O-line Favre had, at least not yet, but I would say Rodgers has decent weapons around him. Still, I give Rodgers a ton of credit for going through the bullshit he went through and not complaining. You know he felt like he could start and it was killing him biding his time behind a legend in the GB area.

rich said...

I take it all back. If Carson Palmer is worth a first and a conditional first... Luck is probably worth nine firsts.

Murray said...

Martin you ain't kidding. That MNF game was awful. I'm sure it comes off as bias because I'm a Pats fans but howcome Revis is the only DB in the league playing under the pre 2004 contact rules. It's maddening

Bengoodfella said...

Rich, I can't believe what the Raiders gave up for Palmer. Statistically, he is just a minor upgrade over Jason Campbell. What a terrible move in my opinion.

Murray, I didn't see the game last night, but Revis probably has gotten away with more contact b/c he is seen as a better defender. He may get more leeway.