Friday, February 21, 2014

6 comments Skip Bayless Further Confirms His Awfulness by Writing about Peyton Manning's Legacy

This article was written before the Super Bowl. I wish I had a chance to post it prior to the Super Bowl, but I couldn't find a way to squeeze it in. Fortunately, bad journalism has no expiration date. Skip Bayless makes Peyton Manning's legacy all about Skip Bayless. See Skip Bayless thinks that Peyton Manning is a great regular season quarterback, but this makes Skip Bayless wonder why Manning doesn't play as well in the postseason, which makes Skip Bayless question Manning's legacy. Mostly Manning's legacy is about Skip Bayless and his perception of Peyton Manning. Skip isn't able to discuss Manning's NFL legacy with any type of impartiality or perspective because Skip doesn't know how to make any discussion of an athlete not about him. So while Skip was right about how difficult the Seahawks defense is, not shockingly he makes Manning's legacy about him.

The problem with Skip and so many sportswriters is the idea their reactions are based mainly on the immediacy of the event. John Elway lost three Super Bowls early in his career and won two Super Bowls in his last two seasons. Idiot sportswriters only remember Elway going out a winner, so his legacy is that of a winner, despite having a career losing record in the Super Bowl. Tom Brady won three Super Bowls early in his career and hasn't won another since, so now certain idiots question whether he's good enough to win a Super Bowl. Peyton Manning didn't win a Super Bowl early in his career, but won one in the middle of his career and has lost two Super Bowls since. So obviously there needs to be a discussion about his legacy. Let's forget he's still one Super Bowl loss behind John Elway, yet it doesn't matter because Elway went out a winner. The immediacy is all that matters and in the immediate time, Peyton Manning can't win a Super Bowl and has a losing career playoff record. Summing up Manning's career legacy based on his postseason postseason is just as stupid as summing up Jack Morris's career legacy based on his postseason performance.

I've never been the biggest Peyton Manning fan.

I've never cared what you think about a certain athlete. Your opinion is usually stupid. LeBron James sucks, Tim Tebow is's all very confusing and obvious trolling.

I've long admired his dedication and the dignity with which he treats the game and its history. But even now I remain skeptical of his postseason legacy, which has never measured up to a status I conceded three years ago: Greatest Regular-Season Quarterback Ever.

So Skip remains skeptical of Manning's postseason legacy because Manning isn't as successful in the postseason as he is in the regular season and Manning can't live up to what Skip Bayless thinks about Manning during the regular season. So Bayless is skeptical of Manning because he can't live up to the expectations Bayless has for Manning. Sure, makes sense.

Of course, for Peyton Manning, whose little brother Eli has two Super Bowl wins (over Tom Brady!)

Two Super Bowl wins over Tom Brady makes these authentic two Super Bowl wins. Tom Brady has Super Bowl victories over Kurt Warner, Jake Delhomme, and Donovan McNabb, so Brady really only has one Super Bowl victory in the mind of Skip Bayless.

to Peyton's one (over Rex Grossman?) while Eli has also led the NFL in interceptions three times, Greatest Regular-Season Quarterback must be starting to feel like a consolation prize.

And of course Peyton won his Super Bowl over Rex Grossman, who apparently was playing offense and defense, so this isn't an impressive Super Bowl victory. Nevermind that Manning had to beat Trent Green, Steve McNair, and Tom Brady on his way to winning that Super Bowl, that doesn't matter to Skip Bayless. Nevermind that Manning had to beat Philip Rivers and Tom Brady this year to make the Super Bowl, that probably doesn't matter to Skip. Only the opposing quarterback in the Super Bowl matters to him and none of the quarterbacks Manning beat on the way to the Super Bowl is impressive to Skip, mostly because Skip isn't capable of using logic through a complete line of thought without yelling. It's not like the 2006 Bears had a good defense or anything of course.

But now, the mouth of Seattle Seahawks cornerback Richard Sherman has opened and out has flown, like a fire-breathing dragon, the greatest opportunity Peyton could have ever wished for: a Super Bowl foe who's a nine out of 10 on degree-of-difficulty scale.

The 2013 Seattle Seahawks are 4th in the NFL in rushing yards per game, 26th in passing yards per game, 1st in passing yards allowed per game, and 7th in rushing yards allowed per game.

The 2006 Chicago Bears were 15th in rushing yards per game, 14th in passing yards per game, 11th in passing yards allowed per game, and 6th in rushing yards allowed per game. The Bears definitely weren't the 2013 Seahawks, but they weren't terrible either.

My point is that a Super Bowl victory is a Super Bowl victory and Skip Bayless will always find a reason to criticize Peyton Manning if he chooses to do so. Look no further than Skip criticizing LeBron James even after he has two NBA titles.

Peyton is about to throw into the teeth of the Legion of Boom. The '85 Bears mostly terrorized passers before they threw. Sherman & Co. more often make QBs and receivers pay after the ball has been thrown -- with interceptions and concussions.

But football is a team game. Peyton played terribly against the Seahawks, but his offensive line didn't help him, and quite frankly, that's the first game where I really saw his lack of arm strength has shown itself to be a liability. The Seahawks just beat the Broncos in every facet of the game. It wasn't a Peyton Manning-caused loss.

So, with Sherman relegating Peyton to Best Supporting Actor next week -- with the sports world hanging on Sherman's every word about how devastating Seattle's secondary can be -- the credibility of Peyton's challenge will rise by the sound bite.

To Skip's disappointment, Richard Sherman didn't give many good sound bites the week of the Super Bowl. I think Skip just doesn't like Peyton's legacy because he is angry Peyton took Tebow's job as the starting quarterback for the Broncos. Also, it is hilarious for Skip Bayless to question the legacy of Peyton Manning while still championing Tim Tebow as a viable NFL starter.

Yep: For Peyton, Seattle is a IX in Super Bowl degree of difficulty.

Yes, it was. That's why it's not fair to judge his legacy based solely on the outcome of this Super Bowl. The Seahawks have a historically great defense. Football is a team game and Manning can't block for himself, catch the football or make his arm any stronger at the age of 37.

For now, I rank him no higher on my all-time list than sixth, behind (in order) Joe Montana, Brady, John Elway, Roger Staubach and Brett Favre.

I'm not falling for this shitty trolling. Brett Favre has one Super Bowl ring in two tries. At least Peyton was better in the regular season than Favre and he has made one Super Bowl than Brett Favre made. I'm not falling for this trolling attempt and will not comment on it.

Until his two recent home wins over the San Diego Chargers and New England Patriots, Peyton had lost three straight playoff games. I'm sorry, but, by Peyton Manning standards, that's sorry.

Yes, his postseason record seems to be at odds with his regular season record. Is it really fair to hold Manning to his regular season standard when he is playing better teams consistently in the playoffs? Skip is essentially saying that Manning is ruining his legacy because he can't match his own regular season legacy. Couldn't the fact Manning doesn't live up to his standards in the regular season just serve as an example of how good Manning is in the regular season? Isn't this part of his legacy too?

But what if he added IX exclamation points to his regular-season record 55 touchdown passes and 5,477 passing yards by lowering the boom on the Legion of Boom in Super Bowl XLVIII and forcing Sherman to say Peyton made him look mediocre? What if Denver wins, say, 38-10 and DeMaryius catches three TD passes?

Then Peyton Manning would have had an outstanding regular season and capped it off with an outstanding Super Bowl. It didn't happen and the Seahawks offense made the Broncos offense look mediocre. Not all of this can be placed on Peyton Manning. He didn't fumble the football, he didn't snap the football over his own head on the first play of the game, and he didn't give up a touchdown return on the first play of the second half. Yes, he threw two interceptions, including one for a touchdown, but the Seattle defense was swarming. Sometimes you just get your ass kicked.

Good gracious, a few might even leap to the prisoner-of-the-moment conclusion that Peyton's sensational longevity capped off by the greatest regular season ever and a Super Bowl destruction of Sherman's defense pole-vaults Peyton past (dare I say) Montana.

I love how Skip accuses others of making a "prisoner-of-the-moment" conclusion when he is writing an entire column stating, "If Peyton Manning wins this Super Bowl then I will re-think his entire legacy." Skip Bayless sucks and he's a troll. He's so terrible and incompetent at writing, I almost feel sympathy for him. He talks about others leaping to conclusions after the Super Bowl, but he's willing to change his opinion about Peyton Manning had his Broncos won the Super Bowl over the Seahawks.

For sure, I would have to rethink Peyton's greatness.

But this is no "prisoner-of-the-moment" conclusion of course.

Peyton's increasingly happy feet made me happy when he struggled against my Commodores, and I lost more respect when he lost to Florida all three times he faced the Gators.

Well, at least Skip Bayless didn't make up his mind about Manning before he even entered the NFL. That's good to know.

I've been pretty good predicting the NFL success of college QBs -- with one glaring swing and miss: I said I would take Ryan Leaf over Peyton Manning. I was not alone. In fact, that was the first and last time I took to the bank what several college coaches told me: Leaf was a gunslinger who played quarterback like a linebacker and was made of tougher stuff than Peyton Manning. I obviously had no idea Leaf battled demons that soon would destroy his career.

So clearly it wasn't Skip's fault that he was wrong about Ryan Leaf. There were circumstances out of Skip's control. And also, Skip is wrong about Peyton Manning if he lost respect for Manning prior to Manning even playing in the NFL. Manning may excel in a timing-based offense with a lot of short throws (or it feels that way these days) and have a career losing playoff record, but he's one of the best quarterbacks in NFL history.

Then again, I must admit I've always preferred my all-time great quarterbacks to play with more rifle-armed flair than Peyton ever has.

The exception to this of course being Tim Tebow. He was more shotgun-armed. He threw the ball and it sort sprayed all over the field and would occasionally hit it's target.

From the start, Peyton played NFL quarterback as if he were a hyper chess master. He created a game above the mud-and-blood game of football, a mind game with which he could toy with superior athletes. His arm strength was pretty average, but his decision-making and release were speed of light and his accuracy deadly.

I always love how NFL guys seem to leave out Peyton's pocket awareness when describing his great abilities. Even in the Super Bowl, Peyton got rid of the ball (granted, a couple of times to the opposing team) as opposed to getting sacked.

Yet, despite all the weapons at his fingertips -- Marvin Harrison for 11 seasons, Reggie Wayne for 10, Dallas Clark for eight, Edgerrin James for seven -- those teams too often failed on the playoff stage against more physical teams that could turn the game back into football.

Manning hasn't always played with the best defenses either. Even this year's Broncos defense was missing their best pass rusher and cornerback in the Super Bowl. It's no excuse, but it's not a coincidence that Peyton Manning won a Super Bowl during the postseason when the Colts defense had a healthy Bob Sanders and stopped the opposing team from running the ball. 

Peyton finally broke through in his ninth season, beating the Bears 29-17 in the rain in Super Bowl XLI. Peyton's team was a seven-point favorite. Degree of difficulty: four.
But give Peyton this: The real Super Bowl that season was the AFC Championship Game in Indy, in which the Colts rallied from 21-6 down against New England to win 38-34. Peyton threw for 349 yards, with one touchdown pass and one interception.

I don't understand why "we" need to give Peyton that. Skip Bayless is the one writing the column stating that Peyton Manning's legacy needs help and that his Super Bowl victory over the Bears was a degree of difficulty of a four. Skip seems to be under the impression that his opinion of Peyton Manning reflects the reader's opinion of Peyton Manning.

Peyton's Colts, of course, lost Super Bowl XLIV to Drew Brees' New Orleans Saints 31-17 (after beating Mark Sanchez's New York Jets 30-17 in Indy for the AFC title).

I like how Skip says it is Mark Sanchez's Jets team as if Peyton putting up 30 points against the Jets #1 ranked defense doesn't mean as much because the opposing quarterback was Mark Sanchez. The fact Manning put up 30 points on a very good defense doesn't count in Skip's book because this didn't happen in the Super Bowl. Skip will always find a way to take credit away from those teams and athletes he simply doesn't like.

The Colts were a five-point favorite over a New Orleans team with the No. 1 offense but just the 25th-ranked defense. Degree of difficulty: five.

And these degree of difficulty rankings are not subjective at all. Also, if the Saints are a degree of difficulty of 5 for a #1 ranked offense and a #25 ranked defense then shouldn't a Super Bowl against a team with the #17 ranked offense and #1 ranked defense be a degree of difficulty of 7 or something, but not a 9? After all, it makes sense to bump the degree of difficulty up two numbers for a #1 ranked unit and a #17 ranked unit. Bumping the degree of difficulty up to a 9 doesn't make sense given Skip's own degree of difficulty rankings. I know, I know, I shouldn't use logic to argue with Skip Bayless.

Most memorable moment: The Colts were driving to tie the score at 24 when, with 3:24 left, Peyton's pass intended for Wayne was intercepted by Tracy Porter and returned 74 yards for the game-breaking TD. Hall of … Blame?

I'm not going to defend this pass from Peyton Manning, but why were the Colts driving down the field at this point in the game? Because they were running the ball really, really well? Actually, they didn't run the ball once on that drive. So Skip acts like the Colts were driving down the field and then Peyton had to step in and throw an interception. Manning was 5-7 for 44 yards on the drive until he threw the interception. Blaming him for the interception is fine, but wanting to act like the Colts were driving for any reason other than Manning's quarterbacking skill is not fine.

Last season, his first in Denver, Peyton did what Peyton often does, delivering the AFC's No. 1 seed off a 13-3 regular season. And Peyton did his part to build a 35-28 lead over eventual Super Bowl champ Baltimore. But, with 31 seconds left, a 70-yard Hail Flacco TD pass forced overtime.

And again, this wasn't Manning's fault. He was winning the game until the Denver defense had a brain fart and Rahim Moore let Jacoby Jones get behind him.

And in the second overtime, the Greatest Regular-Season Quarterback Ever made a shockingly poor decision, throwing a lifeless pass back across his body into the strength of the defense. That interception set up Baltimore's winning field goal.

It was a terrible throw at a terrible time. There was no excuse for that pass. To claim Manning underachieves in the playoffs one would have to ignore the fact that football is a team game and he had done his part to beat the Ravens in regulation. I'm not big on excuses, but when arguing about Manning's legacy there needs to be some perspective given to why Manning had to even throw a pass in overtime.

Reminder: Montana went 4-for-4 in Super Bowls and (I thought) deserved all four MVPs.

Reminder: Montana is considered the best Super Bowl quarterback of all-time, so comparing Peyton Manning to the best ever and saying he doesn't measure up merely acknowledges that Manning isn't the best quarterback in Super Bowl history. This is known. Manning's legacy isn't diminished simply because he isn't better in the Super Bowl than the best Super Bowl quarterback of all-time.

Jerry Rice (11 catches for 215 yards) was MVP of Super Bowl XXIII even though Montana threw for 357 yards, including the winning 10-yard TD pass with 34 seconds left.

And the fact Montana played with Jerry Rice, who is the greatest wide receiver in NFL history, had something to do with Montana's Super Bowl performances. Rice performed well in the Super Bowl as well, which obviously helped Montana go 4-for-4 in Super Bowls.

So, how much has Peyton rebuilt his legacy this postseason?

After the Super Bowl loss, it's the same old shit and the same old narrative.

And cold, hard fact: After the Patriots lost their Richard Sherman -- Aqib Talib -- four plays into the second quarter on what Bill Belichick basically called a Wes Welker cheap shot, Peyton should have won and did, 26-16.

Oh ok, so the Broncos should have won at that point in the game and so Manning doesn't get any credit from Skip Bayless for beating Tom Brady. Funny how that works isn't it? I said earlier that Skip was always going to find a way to not give Manning credit no matter what happens and this is proof of that. Skip states Manning hasn't ever beaten a really great team to win a Super Bowl, while ignoring the great quarterbacks Manning has beaten on his way to leading his team to the Super Bowl. But this AFC Championship victory over Tom Brady doesn't count because Aqib Talib got injured. Skip will always find a way to take away credit. He is always has a horseshit excuse.

Not only was Peyton unsacked in either home game, he was touched only once in each game. Seattle is tied for eighth in sacks.

Manning is good at avoiding being sacked, so going unsacked in both games prior to the Super Bowl wasn't simply the effect of him being the beneficiary of an outstanding offensive line. His pocket presence had something to do with his not being sacked as well. 

Big picture, Peyton at 37 hasn't received nearly enough credit for battling back from four neck procedures and not being able to throw a ball 10 yards. What a second act.

This is false. Peyton Manning was named MVP for the fifth time and was named "Sportsman of the Year" by Sports Illustrated. He's received plenty of credit for battling back from four neck surgeries.

And, Colts fans, I have not eased off my stance that your team made an all-time mistake easing Peyton out the back door in favor of Andrew Luck. Peyton just keeps putting his team in premium positions to make Super Bowl runs.

Skip Bayless is ridiculous in the positions he takes. He tells us that Peyton Manning is the greatest regular season quarterback of all-time, but he has a legacy of failure in the postseason. Along with the fact Manning is on the wrong side of 30, this would make a person think he liked the idea of the Colts releasing Manning and drafting Andrew Luck. But no, Skip doesn't like Peyton Manning enough to give him credit for playoff successes or take away some blame for playoff failures, but he likes Manning enough to think the Colts should have kept Manning over Andrew Luck. But of course. The problem is Bayless has ragged on Andrew Luck and he has to find a way to rectify his position that Manning is a playoff choker (and Manning is going to be 38 years old next year) while stating the Colts should have stuck with Manning over Luck. It's hard for him to do this.

Now Sherman's team has fallen from Super Bowl heaven into Peyton's path. Now, a week from Sunday, it could feel as if Peyton Manning wins two or three Super Bowls that night. I'll be rooting for him.

Even if Peyton Manning and the Broncos had won the Super Bowl, Skip Bayless would have eventually found a way to take away credit from Manning. One has to look no further than LeBron James and his two titles with the Heat to see that Skip Bayless opens his mouth crowing until he is proven wrong and then only opens his mouth to make horseshit excuses for being wrong.


Anonymous said...

I love Skip's degree of difficulty rankings of Super Bowls, as if winning a championship is easy as pie. The 2006 Bears had an outstanding defense that, as we all know, drug Rex Grossman to the Super Bowl. Defeating that defense in a Super Bowl was no small feat.

I'm not going to take anything away from Joe Montana, but I feel like a little perspective is in order. Montana played on a dynastic 49ers team that didn't skip a beat when he was replaced by Steve Young. It's not quite fair to say he was 4-0 in Super Bowls while Manning is 1-2, when you consider that Montana played on teams that were SO MUCH better than their AFC counterparts. Remember, the NFC dominated the AFC back then. The real Super Bowl was the NFC Championship back then. Montana was great, and I'm not saying winning a Super Bowl is easy like Skip does. But at the same time, Montana was 4-0 in Super Bowls in large part because those 49er teams were so great.

My point; football is a team game. Montana didn't win any Super Bowls in Kansas City, remember. I hate this nonsense of "QBs win Super Bowls," like it's tennis or golf. Seattle's defense was ridiculously good this season, the average QB performance against Seattle this season was like Brandon Weeden. Denver got beat soundly by a great defense, that doesn't mean they all suck, it just means Seattle is that good.

JBsptfn said...

Anonymous makes some good points about Montana.

I also think that Skip is wrong about Joe and the MVP comment. Montana should have been MVP against the Broncos in SB XXIV (89 Season), but that's it.

In 81 and 84, the defense won those games more than Joe did. They got critical turnovers, and had a key goal line stand against Cincy in 81. And, in 84, they shut down Marino and his high-flying air attack.

Also, I wonder if Skip is disappointed because he can't lord Tebow over Manning because Peyton took Denver to the SB. Because, if the Broncos would have lost to SD, you would have never heard the end of it from Skip.

Ericb said...

Strong Take:

If Tebow had been Denver's quarterback they would have beaten Seattle because Tebow just wins.

Bengoodfella said...

Anon, the 49ers team didn't really skip a beat once Montana and Bill Walsh left. Your points are all true. The NFC did used to dominate the AFC and the Seahawks defense was historically great. Skip is an idiot and a troll.

JB, I honestly don't remember the 1984 and 1981 Super Bowls, so I will take your word for it...though I do know the Dolphins had a strong aerial attack and the fact they only scored 17 points has to say something for the 49ers defense.

Eric, well obviously. He would have used this Tebow Magic.

Eric said...

The thing that bothers me about analysis of Peyton Manning and his postseason legacy in general is that nobody seems to ever talk about the downright shitty defense they put on the field year after year. It was Freeney, Mathis, and nobody else (because Bob Sanders was a freaking china doll). They always had tiny linebackers with no speed (not a good combo in the NFL). They also had terrible DBs. Just look at the guy who went to the Saints (can't remember the name). He was even worse after hitting free agency. They made the mistake of overloading on offense at the expense of defense. They were able to score all over the place until they had to play legit teams in the playoffs. While Manning wasn't great in a lot of those games, I'm not sure any team in history has won a Super Bowl with defenses that bad.

With that said, of course Brett Favre is better. Having a shitty run of 7 years where your specialty is throwing to the other team is top 5 all time worthy. Fun stuff.

Bengoodfella said...

Eric, it's not a coincidence the Colts won the Super Bowl the year the defense stepped up in the playoffs.

Brett Favre is the best QB ever. His passion, his fire, his love for the game. It's all what makes him the best.

Signed, Peter King